Transcripts to Tags: How Podcasting 2.0 is Changing the Game with Daniel J. Lewis

Speaker: 00:00:04

*** AUTOMATED TRANSCRIPTION ***

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:18

And we're live. Welcome to the podcast editor

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:21

mastermind, the podcast about the business side of podcast

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:25

editing, the show by editors, for editors.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:29

We are so glad you decided to join us. I'm

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:33

Jennifer Longworth. You can find me at Bourbon Barrel Podcasting, and below

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:37

me is Bryan Entzminger. You can find me at toptieraudio.com.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:00:41

And, Jennifer, do you wanna introduce our guest? I would love to. Our special guest

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:44

today is Janiel j Lewis, one of the newly inducted

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:48

members of the podcast hall of fame. Got to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:52

be there for that and, at Podfest. So congratulations, and welcome

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:56

to the show. Thank you so much. It was great to have you there with

Jennifer Longworth: 00:00:59

Daniel J. Lewis: me as well, Jennifer, to celebrate, and and it's great to be here to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:03

Daniel J. Lewis: talk about one of the things I'm most passionate about right now besides podcasting, of

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:07

Daniel J. Lewis: course, in general, but one of the specific things. Yeah. And that topic

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:10

is podcasting 2.0, which I don't know anything

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:14

about. I went to a session about it at Podfest and went,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:18

yeah. I know nothing about this. I need to have someone on my show to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:21

tell me all about this. I'm happy to help. So

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:25

just as a overview, I've been hearing podcast

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:28

2.0 for a while, but I had no idea what it was. For someone

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:32

who's like, well, I don't even know. I haven't even figured out 1 point o

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:36

yet. What is this 2 point o? And what's the basic

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:39

overview? Yeah. Think about it as 1.0 first. We've had

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:43

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 1.0 pretty much untouched since the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:47

Daniel J. Lewis: beginning. Sure. Along the way, Apple added some additional

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:50

Daniel J. Lewis: tags, like we got the episode number field, season number field, and a

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:54

Daniel J. Lewis: couple other things here and there. But besides that, podcasting

Jennifer Longworth: 00:01:58

Daniel J. Lewis: development and innovation has been somewhat stagnant for

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:02

Daniel J. Lewis: years. Even though the ability to extend

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:06

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting has existed since the beginning because RSS

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:10

Daniel J. Lewis: let's get a little technical here. RSS is just a

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:13

Daniel J. Lewis: particular flavor of XML code, and the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:16

Daniel J. Lewis: x in XML stands for extensible. So

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:20

Daniel J. Lewis: from the beginning, this thing, the core technology that makes the distribution

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:24

Daniel J. Lewis: of podcast possible, RSS feeds, has always been

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:28

Daniel J. Lewis: extensible, but people have tried to do things with it

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:32

Daniel J. Lewis: and extend it, and it's just not gone anywhere. So

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:35

Daniel J. Lewis: when Adam Curry, the cocreator of podcasting

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:39

Daniel J. Lewis: himself, decided to really start innovating more in the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:43

Daniel J. Lewis: space and to create podcasting two point o, then things

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:47

Daniel J. Lewis: started catching on. Then we started getting momentum, and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:50

Daniel J. Lewis: developers jumped on board, podcasters jumped on board, podcast

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:54

Daniel J. Lewis: hosting providers, and even what's so exciting like,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:02:58

Daniel J. Lewis: we might do all of this innovation even if Apple and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:01

Daniel J. Lewis: Spotify and Google and all of the big companies never do anything with

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:05

Daniel J. Lewis: the innovations we're making, but it's so exciting that

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:09

Daniel J. Lewis: as of a couple of weeks ago, Apple announced official

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:12

Daniel J. Lewis: support for the transcript tag, which is coming from

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:16

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2.0. They don't say it's podcasting 2 point o, but

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:19

Daniel J. Lewis: they do reference the podcast namespace, which is the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:23

Daniel J. Lewis: technical thing that is extending the RSS feed in order

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:27

Daniel J. Lewis: to enable those podcasting 2.0 feeds. So what

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:31

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2.0 enables is extra functionality

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:35

Daniel J. Lewis: inside of a podcast app if you put this information in your feed and use

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:39

Daniel J. Lewis: your publishing tool to put that in there, and the extra functionality

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:42

Daniel J. Lewis: can benefit you, it can benefit your audience, it can benefit

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:46

Daniel J. Lewis: developers making a better experience in their app, and it can even

Jennifer Longworth: 00:03:50

Daniel J. Lewis: benefit those nasty advertisers. Oh, nasty

Bryan Entzminger: 00:03:54

advertisers. Well, I know a lot of podcasters especially the the us

Bryan Entzminger: 00:03:58

Daniel J. Lewis: indie types, we tend to sometimes think, oh, I don't want advertisers,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:01

Daniel J. Lewis: advertisers are stinky, and I don't like listening to ads.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:05

Daniel J. Lewis: There's a place for ads for sure, but the thing that we often

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:09

Daniel J. Lewis: forget to think about when we are innovating in the space is really

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:13

Daniel J. Lewis: how does this also help the advertisers, the people who have all the money?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:18

Daniel J. Lewis: There are ways that even the advertisers can benefit from this,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:22

Daniel J. Lewis: even if some podcasters don't care about them. This is really interesting to me

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:25

because I've been very much the open source fanboy for a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:29

while. I love what this is about. At the same time, I remember

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:33

Spotify or some people previously from Spotify shared some

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:36

articles a couple years ago about how real innovation

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:40

can never take place in an open environment, that you have to have a closed

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:43

system to truly innovate and that kind of stuff. This seems to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:46

be kind of revealing that as maybe not

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:50

entirely true. What's your perspective? Not true at all. Yeah. Spotify

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:54

Daniel J. Lewis: is, they're frustrating because that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:04:58

Daniel J. Lewis: is their perspective, is they only really know

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:01

Daniel J. Lewis: themselves. And even with the tools that they've developed with Anchor

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:05

Daniel J. Lewis: or now Spotify for Podcasters, it's really about promoting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:09

Daniel J. Lewis: Spotify, and they look internally

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:12

Daniel J. Lewis: for their solutions instead of externally. And that's really hurting the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:16

Daniel J. Lewis: industry because there's so much innovation happening that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:20

Daniel J. Lewis: they just won't listen to. People will ask them, when are you going to support

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:24

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2 point o? And they're just like deer in the headlights,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:28

Daniel J. Lewis: and they just don't know what it is. They

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:31

Daniel J. Lewis: won't look into it. They seem to not care. They

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:35

Daniel J. Lewis: just decide, we're just gonna do our own thing. So, like,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:39

Daniel J. Lewis: even Daniel Ek, the founder, the head of,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:42

Daniel J. Lewis: Spotify right now, has come out and said certain things like

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:46

Daniel J. Lewis: RSS is holding us back. We can't innovate on top of RSS. I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:49

Daniel J. Lewis: think he even said something like we can't extend RSS.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:53

Daniel J. Lewis: And you heard me say it earlier. It is in the very

Bryan Entzminger: 00:05:57

Daniel J. Lewis: definition of what RSS is to be

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:00

Daniel J. Lewis: extensible. So, yes, we can extend it. And will Spotify ever

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:04

Daniel J. Lewis: support any of these new features? I don't know. Maybe now that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:08

Daniel J. Lewis: Apple supports some of them, maybe. But the thing is that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:11

Daniel J. Lewis: we shouldn't be waiting on

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:15

Daniel J. Lewis: these big companies to fix things. Instead, we should be

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:19

Daniel J. Lewis: innovating regardless of what they're doing, and that's what podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:22

Daniel J. Lewis: 2.0 has been doing. And it's just so nice to see some

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:26

Daniel J. Lewis: validation though from a big company like Apple. That's just 1

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:29

Daniel J. Lewis: feature, and transcripts would be we've had people talking about transcripts,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:33

Daniel J. Lewis: so I want to explain that one a little bit more first. People have been

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:36

Daniel J. Lewis: talking about transcripts for a while, but pretty much what they've been talking about

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:40

Daniel J. Lewis: putting in with your podcast is a block of text somewhere.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:44

Daniel J. Lewis: And even worse, putting that block of text in a PDF

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:48

Daniel J. Lewis: file that someone could download. That is not accessible, and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:52

Daniel J. Lewis: the whole point really of transcripts is for accessibility. Yes.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:06:55

Daniel J. Lewis: They're a little bit better than nothing for search engine optimization,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:00

Daniel J. Lewis: but it was just so limited what you could do before. Now there is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:03

Daniel J. Lewis: a specific tag in the RSS feed that enables you to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:07

Daniel J. Lewis: upload a transcript format, not just a PDF, a block of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:11

Daniel J. Lewis: text, but an SRT or a VTT file, which

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:14

Daniel J. Lewis: is a special time stamped where it's line by line with time

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:18

Daniel J. Lewis: stamps in it, you can upload that with your episodes so that in a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:22

Daniel J. Lewis: modern podcast app that supports the transcripts, it can play

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:26

Daniel J. Lewis: like closed captioning in a show. And that's great not

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:29

Daniel J. Lewis: only for the accessibility to hearing impaired

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:33

Daniel J. Lewis: people, but also just understandability. Like, if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:37

Daniel J. Lewis: someone was trying to hear, wait, what was that thing that they said? I couldn't

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:40

Daniel J. Lewis: quite hear them, or they said it too fast, or I didn't quite get that.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:44

Daniel J. Lewis: They could enable the transcript for a moment, see what was said,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:48

Daniel J. Lewis: or maybe they're trying to jot down exactly what you said because it was such

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:51

Daniel J. Lewis: an inspirational quote that they want to write it down verbatim,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:55

Daniel J. Lewis: and they can see that from the transcript. And that kind of idea

Bryan Entzminger: 00:07:59

Daniel J. Lewis: of using excerpts, that's something else that some of these apps could

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:03

Daniel J. Lewis: start to build in where we've had all of these apps before that let you

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:06

Daniel J. Lewis: clip audio. Well, you can have an app that has a little bit of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:10

Daniel J. Lewis: AI to it to recognize where a sentence starts and ends, and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:14

Daniel J. Lewis: let you very easily clip the last sentence that you heard

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:17

Daniel J. Lewis: or the last 2 sentences because that would be enabled through the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:21

Daniel J. Lewis: transcript. And and that's just one feature here with

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:25

Daniel J. Lewis: the transcript. Some of the other really exciting features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:28

Daniel J. Lewis: are the ability to have what we call cross app

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:32

Daniel J. Lewis: comments, which would be where you could comment on a podcast

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:35

Daniel J. Lewis: episode inside of your podcast app. So none

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:39

Daniel J. Lewis: of this going somewhere else to comment on the episode, but you comment in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:43

Daniel J. Lewis: your app, and then someone in a different app

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:47

Daniel J. Lewis: could see that same comment and respond to it, and the podcaster could

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:50

Daniel J. Lewis: get involved with their own app or third party service like Podgagement

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:54

Daniel J. Lewis: or something else. So it's creating this engagement around the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:08:58

Daniel J. Lewis: episodes inside of the app. There are other features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:02

Daniel J. Lewis: like live streaming. If you do live streaming like you guys are doing right here,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:05

Daniel J. Lewis: what you could do is is powered by the thing called the live item

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:09

Daniel J. Lewis: tag, which is like a new item or a new

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:13

Daniel J. Lewis: episode in an RSS feed, but it's wrapped with this live

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:16

Daniel J. Lewis: item tag instead of a normal item tag, and that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:20

Daniel J. Lewis: enables these modern podcast apps to recognize a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:24

Daniel J. Lewis: couple extra features that you add in to say when you're going live. So,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:28

Daniel J. Lewis: like, when we went live tonight, if you use the live item tag

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:31

Daniel J. Lewis: in your podcast RSS feed, someone with a podcasting 2 point

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:35

Daniel J. Lewis: o compatible app would see that notification that you're

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:39

Daniel J. Lewis: going live soon, and then when you go live, they

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:42

Daniel J. Lewis: would receive a notification to be able to tap in that. And

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:46

Daniel J. Lewis: inside of the podcast app, they could listen to the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:49

Daniel J. Lewis: episode live being recorded. That's some of the cool

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:53

Daniel J. Lewis: stuff. So much more that is around engagement, around

Bryan Entzminger: 00:09:56

Daniel J. Lewis: enabling extra features for your podcast, or ways that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:00

Daniel J. Lewis: things can display better. Like, one of the other really cool things is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:04

Daniel J. Lewis: the person tag. Think of it as adding credits to your podcast as a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:08

Daniel J. Lewis: whole or your individual episodes. So, like, if you look inside of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:12

Daniel J. Lewis: Apple Podcasts, for some of the podcasts, if you look down at the bottom of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:16

Daniel J. Lewis: the listing, you'll see a picture of the hosts and cohosts.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:20

Daniel J. Lewis: Well, that right now inside of Apple Podcasts, that's all proprietary

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:24

Daniel J. Lewis: stuff, but we have the ability to do that with RSS feeds now

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:28

Daniel J. Lewis: so that you could very easily see who the hosts are for this

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:32

Daniel J. Lewis: particular episode or the show as a whole, and then the apps can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:35

Daniel J. Lewis: expose that information and cross link it. So if you tap on Brian

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:39

Daniel J. Lewis: Inspiner, you would get to see all the other podcasts that Brian

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:43

Daniel J. Lewis: has been on or been a guest on or hosted. That

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:47

Daniel J. Lewis: kind of thing can be brought into the app. So

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:51

Daniel J. Lewis: all of this stuff, then so many more features too, is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:54

Daniel J. Lewis: about giving the podcaster more control, more features,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:10:58

Daniel J. Lewis: giving the audience more ways to engage with the podcast and learn about

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:02

Daniel J. Lewis: the podcast, and giving developers more opportunities

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:06

Daniel J. Lewis: to make their apps better and a more engaging experience to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:10

Daniel J. Lewis: keep the audience inside of the app. And even for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:13

Daniel J. Lewis: advertisers, there are opportunities like being able to better

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:17

Daniel J. Lewis: track consumption of an episode or track the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:21

Daniel J. Lewis: engagement a little bit better or like with chapters. That's another

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:24

Daniel J. Lewis: thing, another really fun feature. We've had chapters in podcasting for a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:28

Daniel J. Lewis: while, and a chapter is think of it like this. If you're listening

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:32

Daniel J. Lewis: to an audio podcast, and then an image pops

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:35

Daniel J. Lewis: up at a certain point for your sponsor or something that you're talking

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:39

Daniel J. Lewis: about. Maybe you're talking about Hindenburg, and so you display the Hindenburg

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:43

Daniel J. Lewis: logo and a link to Hindenburg that's made possible with a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:46

Daniel J. Lewis: chapter when it happens in the middle of the episode. We've had chapters

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:50

Daniel J. Lewis: for a long time before, m p 3 chapters, enhanced AAC

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:54

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast, but the big problem with that was they were embedded in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:11:57

Daniel J. Lewis: the media file. So if you have ever wanted to change the chapters,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:01

Daniel J. Lewis: you had to change the media file. So if you wanted to update

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:05

Daniel J. Lewis: a chapter, especially for the audience that already downloaded your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:09

Daniel J. Lewis: episodes, you couldn't update it. They would have to redownload it, but would they

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:12

Daniel J. Lewis: wouldn't even know to do that just to get new chapters. So podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:16

Daniel J. Lewis: 2.0 has what we call now super chapters, and that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:19

Daniel J. Lewis: extends things. 1st, it moves it outside of the media file

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:23

Daniel J. Lewis: into a separate file so you can update those chapters

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:26

Daniel J. Lewis: anytime, in the podcast apps that support these modern

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:30

Daniel J. Lewis: chapters will check the chapters every time your audience engages with

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:33

Daniel J. Lewis: your episode, so it looks for any updates. You can do really cool

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:37

Daniel J. Lewis: things with that that can help you as the podcaster, help the audience, even help

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:41

Daniel J. Lewis: advertisers too, like maybe an advertiser, you're using

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:44

Daniel J. Lewis: dynamic ad insertion, and you can then make whatever that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:48

Daniel J. Lewis: chapter link is for your advertiser, you can switch it out based on whatever

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:52

Daniel J. Lewis: your advertiser is for that or whatever you are promoting. Maybe you're

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:55

Daniel J. Lewis: promoting a limited time thing. So for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:12:59

Daniel J. Lewis: this week, the image of that chapter is something that says, like,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:03

Daniel J. Lewis: this week only, and then, a few days later, it

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:06

Daniel J. Lewis: says 2 days left. And then after this week, that image then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:10

Daniel J. Lewis: says, sorry, this isn't available anymore or check back later or something

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:14

Daniel J. Lewis: like that, and that's all done without your having to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:17

Daniel J. Lewis: reupload your media file or anyone having to redownload the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:21

Daniel J. Lewis: episode or anything like that. It's much more dynamic. So it's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:24

Daniel J. Lewis: so much more engagement is possible with podcasting 2 point

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:28

Daniel J. Lewis: o. So since we're a show by editors for

Jennifer Longworth: 00:13:31

editors, why should editors care? And how do we

Jennifer Longworth: 00:13:36

absorb and process this knowledge and then convey it to our

Jennifer Longworth: 00:13:39

clients? Brian? I've got my podcaster hat on right now, and I'm loving this. And

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:43

part of me is going, how do I do all these things? The other part

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:46

is if I put on my editor's head, like, is there a way that I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:49

can use this to differentiate myself? Is there a way that I can use this

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:53

to bring value to my clients that they wouldn't have normally expected in a way

Bryan Entzminger: 00:13:57

that's valuable to them? Like, I'm gonna be selfish. How can I make it valuable

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:00

to me? Yeah. Most of this happens on the publishing side because

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:04

Daniel J. Lewis: it's in the RSS feed. So most of it would then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:07

Daniel J. Lewis: be something that if you're only editing the audio or

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:11

Daniel J. Lewis: video of the episode,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:22

Daniel J. Lewis: and eventually someday coming to Adobe Audition and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:25

Daniel J. Lewis: Audacity recently started implementing transcripts in Audacity,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:30

Daniel J. Lewis: there's the option and the opportunity for you as the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:33

Daniel J. Lewis: editor to go ahead and get that transcript for your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:37

Daniel J. Lewis: client. And as you're editing the audio,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:41

Daniel J. Lewis: you're able to also refine the transcript a little bit because you're

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:44

Daniel J. Lewis: familiar with what's in the episode. Like, for example, when I edit my own transcripts,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:48

Daniel J. Lewis: and I use an AI system to generate my transcripts, but one

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:52

Daniel J. Lewis: of the things I look for is I always look for, proper nouns

Bryan Entzminger: 00:14:56

Daniel J. Lewis: and URLs, and I go back and correct those. Because, like, just my own

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:00

Daniel J. Lewis: domain, for example, theaudacitytopodcast.com,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:04

Daniel J. Lewis: there are several things that the AI often gets wrong. Like,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:07

Daniel J. Lewis: sometimes it doesn't include the word the in the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:11

Daniel J. Lewis: domain. Sometimes it has that as the space

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:14

Daniel J. Lewis: audacity to podcast. Sometimes it says the 2 is the number

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:18

Daniel J. Lewis: 2 instead of t o. Sometimes

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:22

Daniel J. Lewis: it hears audacity as some different word

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:25

Daniel J. Lewis: like oddity or something else like that, and so weird things

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:29

Daniel J. Lewis: like that can happen. So I just look for any occurrence of, like,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:33

Daniel J. Lewis: .com, .org, .net based on whatever I remember saying in my episode.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:37

Daniel J. Lewis: I look for any occurrence of a slash to make sure whatever comes after the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:40

Daniel J. Lewis: slash is correct. So like theaudacitytopodcast.com/microphones.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:46

Daniel J. Lewis: So I check to make sure that's correct, And those proper nouns, I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:50

Daniel J. Lewis: can check. So this is because I'm familiar with my own content and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:53

Daniel J. Lewis: what I said in it, I can correct the transcript. So you as

Bryan Entzminger: 00:15:57

Daniel J. Lewis: editors could also do that same thing, especially if you're working

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:00

Daniel J. Lewis: with a tool. Now several of them are starting to let you see the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:04

Daniel J. Lewis: transcript in your editing workflow. You could very easily

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:07

Daniel J. Lewis: see, wait, that transcript doesn't match what was just now

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:11

Daniel J. Lewis: said. I'm just gonna correct that really quickly. And, yeah, that does

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:14

Daniel J. Lewis: take a little bit more time, but then that's a value add that you

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:18

Daniel J. Lewis: can offer to your clients to say, by the time

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:22

Daniel J. Lewis: this episode is edited, I can also provide for you the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:25

Daniel J. Lewis: transcript. It's AI powered, but I did a little bit of touching

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:29

Daniel J. Lewis: up as I was going through and editing your content to make sure

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:33

Daniel J. Lewis: your names, brand names, proper nouns were all correct, and your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:36

Daniel J. Lewis: URLs are all correct. You can offer that. As well as

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:40

Daniel J. Lewis: since you're working with the audio, you could either

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:44

Daniel J. Lewis: by AI powered or just as you're making it, you could take

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:47

Daniel J. Lewis: note of the time stamps for when the subject

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:51

Daniel J. Lewis: changed because those could be chapters, and you could offer

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:54

Daniel J. Lewis: those chapters, even create the chapter file for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:16:58

Daniel J. Lewis: your client so that they could upload that in their system or copy and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:02

Daniel J. Lewis: paste it. So that could be something too that's coming then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:06

Daniel J. Lewis: from the audio editing process. That then is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:09

Daniel J. Lewis: a value add for you to then give to them and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:13

Daniel J. Lewis: say, here's something else. Now your podcast can be podcasting 2 point

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:17

Daniel J. Lewis: o compliant because here are these 2 things I've done for you that you can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:21

Daniel J. Lewis: then add in your publishing tool, or if you work with the publishing

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:24

Daniel J. Lewis: tool yourself, certainly, you can do a lot more for them with

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:28

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2 point o. So I do publish for,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:32

like, half my clients. About half of them, I send them the file back,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:36

and the other half, I put into their media host, some of which have podcast

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:39

two point o and some of them that are getting there maybe.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:44

Daniel J. Lewis: Lipson. I didn't say any memes. I

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:48

Daniel J. Lewis: didn't say Lipson. Like, who was talking about Lipson? Who who

Jennifer Longworth: 00:17:52

Daniel J. Lewis: thinks that Lipson is behind on this? But that's a great

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:55

point. Right? Because as these are new features, right, they're not

Bryan Entzminger: 00:17:59

evenly supported among media hosts. How much would we have to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:03

stay on top of which hosts our clients are using and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:06

what's available to them. Because I would hate to I'm not gonna throw

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:10

any particular company on the bus. But let's say that I was creating the chapters

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:14

for them, and I haven't done my due diligence or I'm on a consulting call

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:18

and they haven't decided who they're gonna host with and then they hire me. I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:21

provide them this chapter's file, and their host doesn't support it. Like, that's kind of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:24

an embarrassing situation to be in. I'm charging them for something that they now can't

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:28

use. Do we have to stay on top of this? Like, what are your thoughts?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:32

Daniel J. Lewis: It is something that I think that you can encourage your clients to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:36

Daniel J. Lewis: make sure that they're using a hosting provider that supports podcasting 2 point

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:39

Daniel J. Lewis: o or at least gives the flexibility that you can add

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:43

Daniel J. Lewis: these tags in manually yourself, which gets complicated.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:47

Daniel J. Lewis: I'm working on the website. We didn't even mention this. Podcasting2.org

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:52

Daniel J. Lewis: is now the home of podcasting 2 point o. It has a lot of technical

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:56

Daniel J. Lewis: technical information there, but we're also working on making it a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:18:59

Daniel J. Lewis: whole lot more user friendly, and podcaster and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:03

Daniel J. Lewis: audience friendly and speaking in regular terms that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:07

Daniel J. Lewis: mere mortals, the rest of us can understand, but we really wanna

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:10

Daniel J. Lewis: focus on the benefits through that site. So one of the things I'm making

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:14

Daniel J. Lewis: there is a tag generator. So even if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:18

Daniel J. Lewis: like, from since I mentioned Libsyn, Libsyn

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:21

Daniel J. Lewis: 4 lets you actually manually insert RSS tags. I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:25

Daniel J. Lewis: think Podomatic also lets you

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:29

Daniel J. Lewis: manually insert some RSS tags yourself. So even if they don't

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:33

Daniel J. Lewis: support some of these features, if you have that ability to put in the RSS

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:36

Daniel J. Lewis: code yourself, you could generate that and put that in. But the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:40

Daniel J. Lewis: the big thing so if someone is let's say they're

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:44

Daniel J. Lewis: going to Spotify for podcasters, why would you have them

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:47

Daniel J. Lewis: as a client if they're gonna do that? But that aside, if they're going

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:51

on It's a conversation we've had. Yeah. And if they're going on a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:55

Daniel J. Lewis: platform like that, you could encourage them to do something

Bryan Entzminger: 00:19:59

Daniel J. Lewis: different, but if they're really set on whatever platform it is,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:03

Daniel J. Lewis: I mentioned Spotify for Podcasters because that's probably going to be the last

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:06

Daniel J. Lewis: ever to support podcasting 2 point o. What you could do

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:10

Daniel J. Lewis: is if they just will not switch, you still

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:13

Daniel J. Lewis: have an option of a couple services are starting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:17

Daniel J. Lewis: to enable you to layer on some of these features.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:21

Daniel J. Lewis: Like, Blueberry has a service called podcast mirror,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:24

Daniel J. Lewis: podcastmirror.com. It was free for a while. Now it does

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:28

Daniel J. Lewis: cost. There is no free plan. You might remember the old

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:32

Daniel J. Lewis: days of FeedBurner where we would take an RSS feed that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:36

Daniel J. Lewis: was not a podcast RSS feed and turn it into a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:39

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast RSS feed with feed burner through what back then they had the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:43

Daniel J. Lewis: smart cast feature. Feed burner is completely rebuilt now. It's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:47

Daniel J. Lewis: really just pretty much a feed proxy service. You still can add some of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:51

Daniel J. Lewis: that podcast information. Don't use it like that, but

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:54

Daniel J. Lewis: what podcast mirror from Blueberry, the podcast hosting company,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:20:58

Daniel J. Lewis: what podcast mirror can do is it can take a podcasting 1

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:02

Daniel J. Lewis: point o feed and turn it into a podcasting 2 point o

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:06

Daniel J. Lewis: feed, allowing you to add some extra stuff

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:09

Daniel J. Lewis: on mainly the main top level. So you can't add

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:13

Daniel J. Lewis: the episode transcripts, at least not yet. You can't add

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:17

Daniel J. Lewis: episode level information, but you could add things like

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:21

Daniel J. Lewis: the value for value, Satoshi streaming. You could add

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:24

Daniel J. Lewis: things like the person tag at the top level of the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:28

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast. You can add a few other things like that to the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:31

Daniel J. Lewis: RSS feed. So you'd run your feed through podcast

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:35

Daniel J. Lewis: mirror, and on the other side, you get a new feed URL

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:39

Daniel J. Lewis: that then has some of these podcasting 2 point o features.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:44

Daniel J. Lewis: That does cost. Right now, it's I believe it's $60

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:47

Daniel J. Lewis: a year with Blueberry. I don't know if it's even part of their

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:51

Daniel J. Lewis: affiliate program that you're getting any kind of affiliate payment if you referred

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:55

Daniel J. Lewis: people to them. I'm not sure about that. But it's a proposal that you could

Bryan Entzminger: 00:21:59

Daniel J. Lewis: include with them to say, alright, if you want

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:02

Daniel J. Lewis: transcripts and chapters, I'm happy to do that for you. That's going to be

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:06

Daniel J. Lewis: this little add on, an additional service, and we're going

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:10

Daniel J. Lewis: to have to set you up with PodcastMirror so that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:13

Daniel J. Lewis: you can take advantage of a few of these more features. Although,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:17

Daniel J. Lewis: unfortunately, chapters and transcripts are not something that PodcastMiner can do

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:21

Daniel J. Lewis: Right. Yet. They said it's just a technical limitation right

Bryan Entzminger: 00:22:24

Daniel J. Lewis: now, so it's something I'm sure they're working on. So when I had these

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:28

consultation calls with new clients, which seem to be coming out of the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:32

woodwork for me right now, and they say, which media host should I

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:36

choose? I'm starting to think I need to steer them away from certain

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:39

places and to other places, but I'm not sure which places those

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:43

are nor if how much it really matters. And I

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:46

don't have anybody on Lipson. I kind of hate to throw Lipson under the bus

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:50

Daniel J. Lewis: a bit because they've been around the space and supported podcasters

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:54

Daniel J. Lewis: for so long. It's just the truth that we have to be honest about

Jennifer Longworth: 00:22:58

Daniel J. Lewis: is that they do not have native support for podcasting 2 point o

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:02

Daniel J. Lewis: features built in. So if you have a client that's really

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:05

Daniel J. Lewis: interested and wants to take advantage of the podcasting 2 point o features,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:09

Daniel J. Lewis: The places that I personally recommend are if

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:13

Daniel J. Lewis: they like a WordPress workflow, then Blueberry because it's all right

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:17

Daniel J. Lewis: there with WordPress, and it integrates really nicely and everything. If

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:21

Daniel J. Lewis: they're not wanting a podcast focused workflow, then the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:24

Daniel J. Lewis: other 2 places I highly recommend are Captivate and Buzzsprout.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:29

Daniel J. Lewis: Both of them are really good with their podcasting 2 point o support,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:32

Daniel J. Lewis: Captivate more so than Buzzsprout. And I think that Captivate,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:36

Daniel J. Lewis: while they don't have the most podcasting 2 point o features,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:40

Daniel J. Lewis: I think that they've implemented them the best, and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:23:44

Daniel J. Lewis: Buzzsprout, I would say, is the easiest. I think that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:23:48

would probably mirror my impressions of them. I've not worked on a Buzzsprout

Bryan Entzminger: 00:23:51

show, but hearing them talk about how they work with their or how

Bryan Entzminger: 00:23:55

their workflows work, because I listen to their podcast because I'm a nerd,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:23:59

it sounds like they're very focused on that new indie podcaster that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:03

doesn't wanna learn all the, the technical stuff. We're

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:06

hosted with Captivate, so I'm reasonably familiar with what they offer in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:10

terms of 2 point o features. We've got some of them enabled for our show

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:14

right now. One thing I'm wondering is I would love

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:18

to be able to use the live item tag, but I don't think that that's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:21

currently supported natively by Captivate. Is there a workaround

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:25

other than PodcastMirror? Right now, no.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:29

Daniel J. Lewis: But that is something that you can do with Podcast Mirror

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:32

Daniel J. Lewis: because, technically, even though it's a live

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:36

Daniel J. Lewis: item, it actually goes at the channel level. So it would go

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:40

Daniel J. Lewis: before the episodes. It doesn't go inside an episode.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:43

Daniel J. Lewis: It basically goes before the episodes even though it is an episode,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:48

Daniel J. Lewis: technically different. So that is something that could work with podcast

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:51

Daniel J. Lewis: mirror. The support for these specific features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:55

Daniel J. Lewis: is changing as some of these developers are implementing support,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:24:59

Daniel J. Lewis: and it's changing in the apps too. So that's why podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:03

Daniel J. Lewis: 2.org exists is to help track some of this so you can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:07

Daniel J. Lewis: see what features are supported in what apps. And there's going to a spin

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:10

Daniel J. Lewis: off-site, by the way, that I've actually been working on longer

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:14

Daniel J. Lewis: to show a whole grid of, like, this is how

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:18

Daniel J. Lewis: this feature works in this app, or this is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:22

Daniel J. Lewis: supported fully in this app or partially in this app, even

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:26

Daniel J. Lewis: down to stuff like what apps support hyperlinks in their show

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:30

Daniel J. Lewis: notes, that kind of thing. But that's a spin off site that's not

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:34

Daniel J. Lewis: completely podcasting 2 point o related, but right now

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:37

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2.org, if you go there and, like, if you look at the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:41

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast namespace section and you click on a tag, then you can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:45

Daniel J. Lewis: see the publishing tools and the hosting providers that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:48

Daniel J. Lewis: support that tag, so that if that particular

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:52

Daniel J. Lewis: feature is really important to you, then you can know this is what you should

Bryan Entzminger: 00:25:56

Daniel J. Lewis: recommend then to your clients to use. And thinking

Jennifer Longworth: 00:25:59

about how to, as a listener,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:03

these aren't in Spotify. Spotify doesn't care. What app do

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:07

I need to download and have my listeners download to be able to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:10

take advantage of these. Does that make sense? Yeah. Right

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:14

Daniel J. Lewis: now, it is limited, but it is growing. Because,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:18

Daniel J. Lewis: like, for example, with Apple, with the upcoming Ios

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:22

Daniel J. Lewis: 17.4, or maybe it's even out by the time that the people

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:26

Daniel J. Lewis: listening, download this episode and listen to it. 17.4 is

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:29

Daniel J. Lewis: the version that will include support for the transcripts. So that

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:33

Daniel J. Lewis: will be inside of Apple Podcasts as of 17.4.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:38

Daniel J. Lewis: Other popular apps, Podcast Addict supports a few of these things.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:41

Daniel J. Lewis: Podcast Guru is supporting some of these things.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:45

Daniel J. Lewis: Pocket Casts has done some work to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:49

Daniel J. Lewis: support things, but they not fully, but they are

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:52

Daniel J. Lewis: excited about it. They just haven't done all that much yet.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:26:56

Daniel J. Lewis: I don't quite know what's going on there. But then there are other apps that

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:00

Daniel J. Lewis: are more independent. Some of them programmed by 1

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:03

Daniel J. Lewis: person somewhere, and the best thing to do is go to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:07

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2.org, and there's an apps page where you can then

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:11

Daniel J. Lewis: see here are all of the apps for right now, you can pick a

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:15

Daniel J. Lewis: platform. Like, you wanna see what's everything that works on iOS, what's

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:18

Daniel J. Lewis: everything that works on Android. You click on an app, then you get to see

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:22

Daniel J. Lewis: the list of here are the features that this app supports. So

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:26

Daniel J. Lewis: you can know, oh, this is a really good one, or try it out yourself

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:29

Daniel J. Lewis: to know how good it is that supports all of these features. These are important

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:33

Daniel J. Lewis: to my client. So this is why I'm going to suggest

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:36

Daniel J. Lewis: that my client then promote to their audience

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:40

Daniel J. Lewis: and encourage them even saying things like when they start

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:44

Daniel J. Lewis: to use some of these features, they could say things

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:47

Daniel J. Lewis: like, hey. If you need the transcript for this episode, did you know

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:51

Daniel J. Lewis: that I put transcripts out with the episode and you need a special

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:55

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast app to play it? Get the new podcast app through, and one

Jennifer Longworth: 00:27:59

Daniel J. Lewis: of the places that you can send them is podcastapps.com or newpodcastapps.com or modernpodcastapps.com or

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:01

Daniel J. Lewis: podcastin2.org/apps.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:07

Daniel J. Lewis: They all pretty much have the the same information. It's just different domains, different

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:11

Daniel J. Lewis: designs on these things, but encouraging then your clients

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:15

Daniel J. Lewis: to encourage their audience to use a modern podcast app

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:19

Daniel J. Lewis: to be able to take advantage of these features and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:22

Daniel J. Lewis: to really focus on how does this benefit

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:26

Daniel J. Lewis: the audience. That's the thing that I think is always important to

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:30

Daniel J. Lewis: to bring this back to is even though we can get excited about some of

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:34

Daniel J. Lewis: the technical things or, oh, this is going to be so cool to make this

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:37

Daniel J. Lewis: possible, we need to really think about does the audience

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:41

Daniel J. Lewis: care? Not just even the podcast editors, but the people that

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:45

Daniel J. Lewis: we're editing for their people, do they care

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:49

Daniel J. Lewis: about this kind of stuff? And we can encourage them to care

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:53

Daniel J. Lewis: by pointing out the benefits of things like the transcripts, the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:28:56

Daniel J. Lewis: engagement, the interactions, the opportunities

Jennifer Longworth: 00:29:00

Daniel J. Lewis: to stream money to their favorite podcast through the value

Jennifer Longworth: 00:29:04

Daniel J. Lewis: for value system that the the streaming Satoshis and all of

Jennifer Longworth: 00:29:07

Daniel J. Lewis: that, that kind of thing focusing on that end

Jennifer Longworth: 00:29:10

Daniel J. Lewis: user benefit. One of the things I'm wondering,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:14

as an editor who occasionally gets questions from my clients, Is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:18

it worth it for us to educate our clients or

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:22

even taking it a bit further if a client has heard something through

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:26

a certain unnamed podcast person at a large company

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:29

who thinks it's a big joke, right, is it worth investing the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:33

time to do that? And if so, what are those specific benefits for our

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:37

clients that we should be prepared to to share with them that that will

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:41

help us build that? I have some ideas, but I wanna hear yours.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:45

Daniel J. Lewis: Well, if not you, because some of your clients are might not even be

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:48

Daniel J. Lewis: listening to any podcast about podcasting or keeping up with podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:52

Daniel J. Lewis: news because maybe they're just so busy creating their content and then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:56

Daniel J. Lewis: doing whatever else they do, running their business or their hobbies or their

Bryan Entzminger: 00:29:59

Daniel J. Lewis: life, that they're just not interested in what's going on in the podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:03

Daniel J. Lewis: industry. So this can be opportunities for US

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:07

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast editors to step up and help educate your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:10

Daniel J. Lewis: clients on here are some new cool things that you could do with your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:14

Daniel J. Lewis: podcast. Would you be interested in taking advantage of these features?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:18

Daniel J. Lewis: And I think that those top few features to really point

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:22

Daniel J. Lewis: them toward would be transcripts, chapters,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:25

Daniel J. Lewis: and cross app comments. Those are the the big things that really stand out, I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:29

Daniel J. Lewis: think, that don't cost any money, don't get involved that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:33

Daniel J. Lewis: aren't involved with the crypto and the streaming Satoshis in case anyone is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:37

Daniel J. Lewis: afraid of Bitcoin. But the Bitcoin thing, the streaming Satoshis is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:41

Daniel J. Lewis: kind of nice to be able to do, or micropayments

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:44

Daniel J. Lewis: we could call it. I think those are some of the the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:48

Daniel J. Lewis: top things to really focus on for the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:51

Daniel J. Lewis: audiences. I'm actually glad that you mentioned that. The cross app

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:55

comments, of course, sounds great to me as a podcaster. I've always

Bryan Entzminger: 00:30:59

thought it's ridiculous to have to send people somewhere else to have the conversation.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:02

Right? We're having this. We wanna extend our conversation, so please

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:06

connect with me on, I don't know, Circle. So or Facebook

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:10

or whatever. So I I love that idea. Is that even

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:13

implemented? Yes. It is. And it is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:18

Daniel J. Lewis: very cutting edge right now. It's a little bit complicated. There

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:21

Daniel J. Lewis: are some issues that need to be figured out, like moderation abilities

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:25

Daniel J. Lewis: and such, but it is something that is being worked on,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:29

Daniel J. Lewis: and it is, I think, the most exciting feature because it is very

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:33

Daniel J. Lewis: audience focused. It's engaging. It's something a podcaster can get

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:37

Daniel J. Lewis: excited about. It just has to be supported, and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:40

Daniel J. Lewis: there are some little hurdles to be worked through. But I think

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:44

Daniel J. Lewis: that this year, 2024 for the record, we will have

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:48

Daniel J. Lewis: this solved, and it will then be more by other

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:51

Daniel J. Lewis: apps. Right now, it's just kind of a lot of stuff is questionable

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:55

Daniel J. Lewis: and a little bit seemingly complicated, but some people are

Bryan Entzminger: 00:31:59

Daniel J. Lewis: saying, no. It's not all that complicated for developers to support this,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:03

Daniel J. Lewis: but it's going to get easier. And that's the cool thing about all of this

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:06

Daniel J. Lewis: is that the technology will disappear

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:11

Daniel J. Lewis: in the sense that we won't have to care about the technology. It can just

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:14

Daniel J. Lewis: get to the point of you publish a podcast episode,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:18

Daniel J. Lewis: and now you can comment from whatever app you want. You the actual

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:22

Daniel J. Lewis: technology you use doesn't matter. That's coming. We're working toward that.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:27

Daniel J. Lewis: So that's definitely one of the exciting things. I I think I can't remember if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:30

Daniel J. Lewis: I said it too, but chapters would be I think another really cool thing that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:34

Daniel J. Lewis: could help break up the content, make the content more reviewable.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:38

Daniel J. Lewis: Yeah. That does mean it's also skippable, but would you rather your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:42

Daniel J. Lewis: audience abandon your episode or skip to exactly what they

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:46

Daniel J. Lewis: want? That's a good question that you could ask to your clients if they're saying,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:49

Daniel J. Lewis: well, would won't they be able to skip? Yeah. And that's a good

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:53

Daniel J. Lewis: thing. Yeah. And David says that they're using it. I'm

Bryan Entzminger: 00:32:57

assuming that he's talking about the cross app comments. That,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:00

to me, seems like the no brainer because I have never talked to a client

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:04

who said I'm getting too much engagement. I wish people would stop getting back to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:07

me. Right? What I always hear is I'm talking into a vacuum.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:11

I never hear anything. I ask people to email me, and they don't.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:14

Yeah. Of course, this can't necessarily fix that, but it

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:18

certainly removes a hurdle. Oh, for sure. And that big

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:21

Daniel J. Lewis: hurdle of stepping outside of the app,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:25

Daniel J. Lewis: that's a big one because once you leave the app,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:29

Daniel J. Lewis: then where do you go? And when you're outside of the app, there are all

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:33

Daniel J. Lewis: of these other distractions of other apps or you get on

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:36

Daniel J. Lewis: to Twitter to send a tweet, an x

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:40

Daniel J. Lewis: tweet, which sounds like you're tweeting your x, that's not it.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:44

Let's not do that. Yeah. You get on there and you want to send a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:47

Daniel J. Lewis: comment and then you get distracted by, oh, here are these other things I'm reading

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:50

Daniel J. Lewis: or just if you're doing this while driving, well, don't.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:55

Daniel J. Lewis: You can't do that. But what if it could be

Bryan Entzminger: 00:33:59

Daniel J. Lewis: so that while you're listening to a podcast and you have something you wanna

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:02

Daniel J. Lewis: say back to the podcast, you just press a button

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:06

Daniel J. Lewis: and start talking, and let go of the button or press the button

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:10

Daniel J. Lewis: again. You stop talking, confirm it, send it, and that's your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:14

Daniel J. Lewis: app. That's your comment, and it's posted in the app, and it's posted in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:18

Daniel J. Lewis: all of the other apps. It could be that kind of thing, and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:21

Daniel J. Lewis: it's right there inside of the app. So keeping people inside

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:25

Daniel J. Lewis: of the app then makes that that,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:29

Daniel J. Lewis: process for people to engage so much more seamless because they

Bryan Entzminger: 00:34:33

Daniel J. Lewis: don't have to go somewhere else then. And so one of the things also I've

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:36

heard is about a pod roll to keep people in the app as a 2

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:40

point o that you can, like, recommend your favorite pod to, hey. If you

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:43

like this, you'd like them too. I mean, am I on target? Or

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:47

Daniel J. Lewis: Yes. Exactly. Right now, if you look in Apple Podcasts, for example,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:51

Daniel J. Lewis: many podcasts will have this, and I've started tracking this with one of my other

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:55

Daniel J. Lewis: services, that you'll see basically, like, you

Jennifer Longworth: 00:34:58

Daniel J. Lewis: might also like or listeners also listens to. That's all algorithmically

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:02

Daniel J. Lewis: generated, and you can't control that. So maybe, you know,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:06

Daniel J. Lewis: you've got the I Love Cats podcast, and then

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:10

Daniel J. Lewis: down at the bottom is the Cats Are Evil, Let's Kill All

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:14

Daniel J. Lewis: Cats podcast. You don't want that recommended on

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:17

Daniel J. Lewis: your podcast. No. Apple for some reason decided you've got enough crossover

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:21

Daniel J. Lewis: audience between these 2 podcasts that they're recommending that, or

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:25

Daniel J. Lewis: maybe you get more control of that with your own recommendations

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:29

Daniel J. Lewis: and that's powered by Podroll. You could also recommend your other

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:33

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasts that you host or your clients could recommend their other podcasts

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:37

Daniel J. Lewis: or other podcasts that they think are very relevant, have some

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:40

Daniel J. Lewis: opportunity to cross promote, even maybe selling some

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:44

Daniel J. Lewis: cross promotion there. What this does then in the apps when

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:48

Daniel J. Lewis: you put in this pod roll, and I hate the name,

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:52

Daniel J. Lewis: but the pod roll comes from the idea of blog roll, and some people

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:55

Daniel J. Lewis: don't even know what blog roll was. It it's really just it's a

Jennifer Longworth: 00:35:59

Daniel J. Lewis: word to describe recommending other podcasts.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:03

Daniel J. Lewis: So think of it as recommendations. You put in there

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:07

Daniel J. Lewis: a certain number of podcasts that you want to recommend, whatever that number is, and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:11

Daniel J. Lewis: then these podcast apps that support it can then display that, and they

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:15

Daniel J. Lewis: might display it in different ways. It might say something like this podcast

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:18

Daniel J. Lewis: also recommends these, or you might also like

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:22

Daniel J. Lewis: just like Apple Podcasts has, but the thing is the podcaster

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:26

Daniel J. Lewis: is in control of this. And that presents

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:30

Daniel J. Lewis: all kinds of opportunities then for some of the collaboration between

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:34

Daniel J. Lewis: these different podcasters and the cross promotion or just growing

Jennifer Longworth: 00:36:38

Daniel J. Lewis: the other podcasts that that same podcaster hosts.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:36:42

Do wanna hit a quick comment before we change directions. David's saying that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:36:46

people are always like they have to install another app. Don't like that. Yeah. Totally

Bryan Entzminger: 00:36:50

get that. I'm in the same boat. And especially when I think about if I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:36:53

was to send people to a platform that's specifically

Bryan Entzminger: 00:36:57

designed to distract them. Right? Most of our

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:01

platforms are designed to get in the way of what you wanted to do to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:04

keep you there so you come back and do what you forgot to do. Right?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:07

And so if it's comment on my thing, I want them to be able to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:09

do that. So I'm totally with that. I would love to be able to get

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:13

people into one place that's distraction free so they could

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:16

focus and then move on with their lives. Thinking about this, again, putting on the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:20

editor or the producer or the podcast manager hat, are there things that we need

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:24

to be careful of or cautious about when it comes to Podcasting 2

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:27

point o and our clients' shows? If you are working with

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:31

Daniel J. Lewis: transcripts, this is something that you need to watch out for is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:35

Daniel J. Lewis: potential liability. If you're working

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:38

Daniel J. Lewis: and you might not always know what to look for because

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:42

Daniel J. Lewis: it could come up in random places, but just an

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:46

Daniel J. Lewis: example here. If your client

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:49

Daniel J. Lewis: said in the podcast, let's not kill puppies,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:53

Daniel J. Lewis: but the transcript didn't catch the word not. So the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:37:56

Daniel J. Lewis: transcript would say, let's kill puppies. You have to watch

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:00

Daniel J. Lewis: out for that kind of thing. That could be very

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:04

Daniel J. Lewis: problematic because then what if it's some kind of medical advice that's being

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:08

Daniel J. Lewis: given? What if it's financial advice or anything like that

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:11

Daniel J. Lewis: that if the wrong advice is practiced, then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:15

Daniel J. Lewis: it puts someone in trouble, the podcaster in trouble. And then the podcaster would

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:19

Daniel J. Lewis: say, well, I didn't personally write that. It was my editor who

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:23

Daniel J. Lewis: put that in there, so then you're in trouble for having something

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:26

Daniel J. Lewis: that wasn't correct. That kind of thing is not very

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:30

Daniel J. Lewis: likely to happen. You would have to look out for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:34

Daniel J. Lewis: the kinds of fields where stuff could get in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:38

Daniel J. Lewis: more trouble like the scientific, medical, financial, legal

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:42

Daniel J. Lewis: fields. Some of those would be more to be very, very

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:45

Daniel J. Lewis: careful with those kinds of things. Some of the other dangers of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:49

Daniel J. Lewis: this would be overselling the dream of this because all of these

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:53

Daniel J. Lewis: features are great and everything. The unfortunate

Bryan Entzminger: 00:38:57

Daniel J. Lewis: truth is that as of February 2024,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:01

Daniel J. Lewis: the apps that support all of these cool features make up

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:05

Daniel J. Lewis: about maybe 2 to 3% of the global

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:09

Daniel J. Lewis: downloads of podcasts. Excluding Apple, I'm guessing since

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:12

17.4 isn't out yet. Of course. So that will significantly change. But,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:16

Daniel J. Lewis: like, the live item tag or cross app comments or things like

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:20

Daniel J. Lewis: that, not very much support right

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:23

Daniel J. Lewis: now. So if you're telling someone about, hey. Let's get you

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:27

Daniel J. Lewis: involved with cross app comments, and then they expect to see it inside

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:31

Daniel J. Lewis: of Spotify, that's not gonna happen. So you have to be careful not to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:34

Daniel J. Lewis: oversell what's possible. But the cool thing is that the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:38

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasts that support these new features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:42

Daniel J. Lewis: and promote the modern apps that support these features,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:46

Daniel J. Lewis: they see a completely different shift. So instead of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:50

Daniel J. Lewis: for most podcasters, Apple Podcasts is going to be number 1, and then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:53

Daniel J. Lewis: Spotify number 2. They some of these platforms see or

Bryan Entzminger: 00:39:57

Daniel J. Lewis: these podcasters see significant shifts where instead of it being Apple

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:01

Daniel J. Lewis: at number 1, it's whatever the particular app is that they

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:04

Daniel J. Lewis: recommend the most as number 1. And then

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:08

Daniel J. Lewis: their audience more of their audience is able to take advantage of those

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:12

Daniel J. Lewis: features. I was checking my stats because I was like, pretty sure Apple is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:16

our winner. And I shouldn't do this because I'm on a show, but I did

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:18

it anyway. So, yeah, Apple's still our winner, but we we don't really

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:22

push the other app. So we do have some of those 2 point o features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:25

enabled, but we haven't spent any time really promoting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:29

other apps. Is that something that you would encourage a show like us

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:32

that's really for the editors to do? It could be, especially because the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:36

Daniel J. Lewis: editors need to be familiar with what are some of these cool new features coming

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:40

Daniel J. Lewis: so that they can better promote it to their clients. You can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:44

Daniel J. Lewis: better promote it to your clients, and it would be nice to then try

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:47

Daniel J. Lewis: some of these things. And where this can then trickle

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:51

Daniel J. Lewis: down to the podcasters and what they do is not only just recommending

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:55

Daniel J. Lewis: these apps in their podcasts or saying, hey. You might wanna try this other

Bryan Entzminger: 00:40:58

Daniel J. Lewis: app, but they might decide to change some of their marketing

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:03

Daniel J. Lewis: instead of making their Apple Podcasts or Spotify link the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:06

Daniel J. Lewis: most prominent link on their website. Maybe instead,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:10

Daniel J. Lewis: they're linking to one of these other apps that a couple of them

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:14

Daniel J. Lewis: are cross platform. Some of them are only Android, some are

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:17

Daniel J. Lewis: only iOS, but they could make those decisions if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:21

Daniel J. Lewis: they decide, wow, this experience is so much better for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:25

Daniel J. Lewis: my audience. I really want to get my audience moved over to this

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:29

Daniel J. Lewis: other app. They can make those decisions to stop saying, find us

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:32

Daniel J. Lewis: an Apple Podcasts or wherever get you get your podcast. They could instead instead

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:36

Daniel J. Lewis: say, well, I really suggest they don't say podcast apps in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:40

Daniel J. Lewis: their calls to action, but they could link to their

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:43

Daniel J. Lewis: page where their page then has those

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:47

Daniel J. Lewis: modern apps more prominent than anything else. And then the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:50

Daniel J. Lewis: audience can start to move over, especially if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:54

Daniel J. Lewis: the podcaster is educated by you, the editor,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:41:58

Daniel J. Lewis: and the podcaster then educates their audience on this is the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:01

Daniel J. Lewis: benefit you would get by switching over to this other app. On a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:05

personal level, I've been on a quest to find a good podcasting 2 point o

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:09

app that is cross platform because I like Cast O Matic, but

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:12

it's iOS only, and I don't like that. I've been checking out

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:16

Podcast Guru, but their list feature is just

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:19

abysmal. Like, they've got a lot of things figured out really well and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:23

but, like, I put things into a list so I can listen to them or

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:26

I have it on them. Anyway, I'm gonna shut up about that. I do have

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:30

a, a question that's a little bit uncomfortable to bring up. But

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:34

one of the things that we were looking for is how

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:37

well represented is the broader community within the podcast two point o

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:41

space. And what I noticed is almost all of the voices that I'm

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:45

hearing are male. And I'm wondering, are there any women

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:49

involved in this? Is it truly a dude thing? And if so, like, what can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:52

is there anything that can be done? Well, here's the thing,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:42:56

Daniel J. Lewis: and this some people might not like the way that I put this. I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:00

Daniel J. Lewis: mean, I I have to refer to stereotypes here because

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:03

Daniel J. Lewis: stereotypes exist because they're kind of true in many cases.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:07

Daniel J. Lewis: Look back to the beginning of podcasting itself. It was

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:11

Daniel J. Lewis: almost all male dominated both on the audience side and the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:15

Daniel J. Lewis: producer side because podcasting is very geeky,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:18

Daniel J. Lewis: and geeky stuff tends to attract

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:22

Daniel J. Lewis: more men than women. That's just kind of the nature of the differences

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:26

Daniel J. Lewis: between men and women. So because of that, because

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:29

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasting 2.0 right now is still very geeky

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:33

Daniel J. Lewis: and technical, although it's already gotten easier than it was a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:37

Daniel J. Lewis: couple of years ago. Because it's kind of geeky, that tends to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:41

Daniel J. Lewis: attract a more geeky audience, which tends

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:45

Daniel J. Lewis: to be more male. That said,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:48

Daniel J. Lewis: there are some women in the space. I don't think there are

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:52

Daniel J. Lewis: any women developing the apps themselves, but I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:43:56

Daniel J. Lewis: know that, she goes by Dame Jennifer. I don't know what it is with

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:00

Daniel J. Lewis: Jennifers and podcasting you guys, but, there

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:03

Daniel J. Lewis: is, yeah, a woman who is involved and excited about this, has

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:07

Daniel J. Lewis: supported it, and she is not a programmer. She's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:10

Daniel J. Lewis: an animator actually, and she just is passionate

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:14

Daniel J. Lewis: about podcasts, and so she's become somewhat of an evangelist for

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:18

Daniel J. Lewis: this and supporting it and helping communicate about it and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:21

Daniel J. Lewis: make little videos here and there and things, and that's something that she's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:25

Daniel J. Lewis: able to do, interested in doing even though she's not developing.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:29

Daniel J. Lewis: And I'm sure there are others. Well,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:32

Daniel J. Lewis: take, Elsie Escobar, for example, has said in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:36

Daniel J. Lewis: the feed, Lipson's podcast, that she said some of these features

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:40

Daniel J. Lewis: are so exciting, but how do we communicate this? How do

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:43

Daniel J. Lewis: we explain this? Or there's limited support. She's bringing out the fact that,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:47

Daniel J. Lewis: yes, there's this truth. Well, her saying that in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:51

Daniel J. Lewis: a recent episode of Libsyn's The Feed is what really

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:54

Daniel J. Lewis: pushed James Cridland and I to finally make

Bryan Entzminger: 00:44:58

Daniel J. Lewis: something happen, and that's why we launched podcasting 2.org

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:02

Daniel J. Lewis: to try to solve that problem of people don't

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:06

Daniel J. Lewis: understand this, or how do we market this? So

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:09

Daniel J. Lewis: that we're hoping that then something like that resource instead

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:13

Daniel J. Lewis: of someone like Elsie Escobar see saying this is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:17

Daniel J. Lewis: great, but instead she can just say, this is

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:20

Daniel J. Lewis: great. Go here to learn more. So she could become an

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:24

Daniel J. Lewis: evangelist because she said she's interested in this. As far as, like, where

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:27

Daniel J. Lewis: else there are men or women, I don't really pay attention

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:31

Daniel J. Lewis: to that. Sure. So I can't really say. And please don't ask me about

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:35

Daniel J. Lewis: skin color or ethnicities because I really have no idea. At all interested in

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:38

that. I was more interested because it is something that I look for,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:42

and I'm of the opinion that there are probably some of those women out there,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:46

we just don't know who they are, and I would love to see because I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:50

came in late, but I'm familiar with the history. I would love to see us

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:53

shortcut that cycle. Right? So I recognize that it's following a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:45:56

similar pattern. I would love to see us shortcut that. So if there are women

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:00

out there that are technically minded or just wanna be that evangelist, my

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:04

encouragement would be please do it. Right? And some of these

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:07

Daniel J. Lewis: features, again, speaking in stereotypes here, I think,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:11

Daniel J. Lewis: Brian, you and I can probably talk about podcasting

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:15

Daniel J. Lewis: for hours on end to someone and never let them

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:19

Daniel J. Lewis: speak at all Because sometimes we can just really nerd

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:22

Daniel J. Lewis: out, and then the other person's just like, okay.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:26

Daniel J. Lewis: Bye. But for women, Jennifer, you

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:29

Daniel J. Lewis: probably again, I know I'm speaking in stereotypes, but

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:33

Daniel J. Lewis: women stereotypically connect more emotionally,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:36

Daniel J. Lewis: and they review conversations in their minds when

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:40

Daniel J. Lewis: they're away from the conversation. They really like the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:44

Daniel J. Lewis: conversations with people, and what I'm leading this into

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:47

Daniel J. Lewis: is cross app comments. So, like, even for women

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:51

Daniel J. Lewis: podcasters, this presents a great opportunity for them

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:55

Daniel J. Lewis: to have those conversations more with their audience,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:46:59

Daniel J. Lewis: to build more intimate connections with their audience, to engage on a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:02

Daniel J. Lewis: deeper level right there inside of the app. So

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:06

Daniel J. Lewis: it's not just about, hey. I'm gonna make my podcast look

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:10

Daniel J. Lewis: better, or, hey. I'm gonna offer transcripts, but it can be about

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:13

Daniel J. Lewis: making those deeper more personal connections

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:17

Daniel J. Lewis: with the podcaster and their audience and even enabling the

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:20

Daniel J. Lewis: audience to connect more with each other,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:25

Daniel J. Lewis: building a community. And that's also a big

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:28

Daniel J. Lewis: thing of what podcasting 2.0 can do is to help

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:32

Daniel J. Lewis: then those relationships be fostered. I did

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:36

wanna hit we had one other comment from David, helping a lot of people he

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:39

met at Podfest get rolling on some two point o features,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:43

telling them about getting workflows in places and getting the mainstream will put them ahead

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:47

of the game. So, yeah, I think that's that's absolutely great.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:51

And, you know, again, my heart really is just how can we get as

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:54

many people as possible enfranchised in this? Because I think it's good

Bryan Entzminger: 00:47:58

For us as editors, I think we do have to kinda take that step back

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:01

and go, okay. How do I make sure that this is valuable for my clients?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:04

Because it can be it can feel the people like we're pushing stuff on them.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:08

And I don't think that's that's not my desire. But at the same time, I

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:11

do want people to take advantage of what's out there. I'm gonna shut up about

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:15

that. Jennifer, did you wanna move on to the Poddecks question, or did you have

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:17

something else? Nope. I was moving on to Poddecks. Time for the Poddecks question of

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:21

the day. This is where, Daniel, you get to choose a number between 1 and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:24

4. We actually have physical cards. These aren't even available anymore. So

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:28

choose a number from 1 to 4. 3. 1, 2, 3.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:32

You know, we mentioned sometimes there are some that don't make it on the air.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:35

You managed to do that. Choose a number between 13. 3.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:39

Okay. Maybe you should look at all the choices before we start

Jennifer Longworth: 00:48:43

next time. Did you just, like, pick all the

Jennifer Longworth: 00:48:47

Daniel J. Lewis: bad ones from here? I I think I did. Alright. So the question

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:50

for today is when were your parents most disappointed in you?

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:55

And I'm not sure I wanna answer that one on the air. So if

Bryan Entzminger: 00:48:58

anybody else wants to, answer that 1 in the comments, you can. How

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:02

about I just choose 1? What was your first screen name? We'll go

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:06

with that one because that's fun. And the first one I can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:10

remember was Maestro Damas because, you know, I wanted to

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:13

be bigger than I really was, and there was a music thing going on there,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:16

so that was mine. What's everybody else's? Selyn DRG.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:49:21

What? Selyn DRG? S e l y n

Jennifer Longworth: 00:49:25

n d r g. There's way too much to unpack there. I'm not

Jennifer Longworth: 00:49:29

gonna do it. Do you do you even remember your

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:32

first screen name, Daniel? Yeah. It was s g t kids,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:36

Daniel J. Lewis: k I d z, because my first business

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:40

Daniel J. Lewis: was selling kids' books. I was a teenager at that point,

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:44

Daniel J. Lewis: selling kids' books like Adventures and Odyssey, audio drama, children's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:48

Daniel J. Lewis: books, and videos and stuff. I was a reseller for Focus on the Family and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:51

Daniel J. Lewis: some other providers, and my mom had

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:55

Daniel J. Lewis: a business also selling Christian books and bread baking supplies and

Bryan Entzminger: 00:49:59

Daniel J. Lewis: certain stuff, and her business was called simply good things.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:03

Daniel J. Lewis: So I thought, well, I'm gonna have the kids division of my mom's

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:07

Daniel J. Lewis: business so that she can handle all that legal stuff, And so my

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:11

Daniel J. Lewis: business would be SGT Kids, but then, like, certain people

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:15

Daniel J. Lewis: started calling it sergeant kids and Sergeant. Yeah. That's what I thought

Jennifer Longworth: 00:50:18

immediately. Nice. Well, we thank everyone for joining

Jennifer Longworth: 00:50:22

us live. If you miss it, you can always come back and

Jennifer Longworth: 00:50:26

watch from the beginning or catch it when it drops. And if you wanna be

Jennifer Longworth: 00:50:29

a guest on our show, what do you do, Brian? Oh, it's nearly

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:33

impossible. You have to go to podcasteditorsmastermind.com/beaguest.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:37

We chose that link because I could remember it. That'll take you to a magical

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:41

form that you fill out and let us know if you'd like to be a

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:43

guest, how we can contact you, what you'd like to talk about. You can also

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:47

use that form to suggest a topic. So if podcasting 2.0 didn't

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:50

resonate with you, but you really wanna know how to land that next client, just

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:54

let us know that's something you'd like us to cover, and we'll see if we

Bryan Entzminger: 00:50:57

can get that in the queue. And then if it's really about how you land

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:00

your next client, go back and listen to q 4 of 2023.

Bryan Entzminger: 00:51:04

We did cover that. Yeah. Because that's all we talked about. I'm Jennifer Longworth. You

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:08

can find me at bourbonbarrelpodcasting.com and Instagram Burbn

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:11

Barrel podcasting. Below me is Bryan Entzmingerr. You can

Bryan Entzminger: 00:51:15

find me at toptieraudio.com. And Daniel has

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:19

been our special guest today. What's the best place for people to connect with

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:22

you? Please go to theaudacitytopodcast.com.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:27

Not appearing in today's episode are Daniel Abindroth at

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:30

Rothmedia.audio and Carrie Caulfield at

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:34

carrie.land. Thank you all so much for joining us, and we'll see

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:37

you in a couple weeks. Our next guest will be Heather Seitzwolff talking about

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:41

scope creep. Thank you. Yay.

Jennifer Longworth: 00:51:47

Daniel J. Lewis: So How much is that?